Wagner - St Joseph Line - Olympic

[gak555]

My friend asked me to get some imput about a wager he placed today on the above game.
The line should have been Wagner -13, but Olympic had the line as St. J -13. My friend knew the line was wrong and bet on Wagner + 13. About 1/2 hour after he placed his bet, it was automatically cancelled by Olympic. The question is whether or not Olympic should honor the wager he placed on Wagner +13. I told him I would post to get some opinions. For the record I do want to say that I use Olympic myself and an extremely happy with them.

[REALITY]

GAK555,

WELCOME TO THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUETE.

HERE ALL ARE WELCOME.

SAINTS AND SINNERS.

YOU WILL GET POINTS OF VIEW FROM BOTH.

MEMBERS IN GOOD STANDING HOPE YOU WILL MAKE THE RIGHT CHOICE.

THE FEW,THE PROUD,THE MEMBERS OF THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUTE...

BROTHER REALITY


Author Topic: POSTING A -18 FAV. AT +18 WHAT IS A BOOK TO DO?
REALITY
Member posted 11-18-2000 09:31 PM
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FINISHING OFF A LESS THAN STELLAR SATURDAY TO SAY THE LEAST, THE LINE MANAGER FOR A MAJOR BOOK I DO CONSULTING WORK FOR CALLED ME ABOUT AN INCORRECTLY POSTED LINE IN HIS BOOK.
AN 18 POINT FAVORITE WAS POSTED AS AN 18 POINT DOG.

SUFFICE IT TO SAY THIS GAME ON THE NET GOT BANGED MORE THAN A LOCAL LADY OF THE NIGHT WHEN THE SAILORS DOCK FOR WEEKEND LIBERTY...

I'M SURE YOU KNOW WHAT I TOLD HIM TO DO.

HOW ABOUT SOME FEEDBACK FROM B.M.'S AND PLAYERS ALIKE.

KEEP IN MIND,YOU STEAL A DIME IT WILL COST YOU A DOLLAR.

BROTHER REALITY

THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUETE


[This message has been edited by REALITY (edited 11-19-2000).]

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gord
Junior Member posted 11-18-2000 10:19 PM
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Reality: I belive that when seeing a bad line the customer should report it and recieve a monetary reward. When a customer bets into a bad line his account should be flagged. After more than one instance the book should warn the customer that he will lose his account privlages if he presists.If the book is considerate enough to delete plays immediatly when a customer makes a mistake then customers should show the book the same consideration.
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REALITY
Member posted 11-18-2000 10:32 PM
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GORD,
WELL THOUGHT OUT ANSWER.

THE FIRST PARISHIONER IN BROTHER REALITY'S CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUETE.

AT LEAST WE KNOW WE CAN TRUST BROTHER GORD WITH THE COLLECTION PLATE.

BROTHER REALITY

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Railbird
Member posted 11-18-2000 11:07 PM
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The cutoff is at -4 on pointspreads and -170 on M.Lines.otherwise its a non issue,offshore.In Vegas however all bets stand.Thats the rule of thumb.
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REALITY
Member posted 11-18-2000 11:13 PM
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RAILBIRD,
COULD YOU EXPLAIN THIS IN A LITTLE MORE DETAIL?

REALITY

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-UB-
Junior Member posted 11-18-2000 11:15 PM
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As long as the book has a rule for obvious line errors, it is ok to delete the bets BEFORE the game kicks. If they do not cancel the bets before the event starts, they should be honored.

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REALITY
Member posted 11-18-2000 11:17 PM
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UB,
WELCOME TO THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUETE,YOUR PARISHIONER #2.

BROTHER REALITY

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jlpblade
Member posted 11-18-2000 11:34 PM
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Can I receive membership for past good deeds (or idiotic behavior)? Many, many years ago I corrected a wager at Sacho's that was 100 times too big. My agent couldn't believe it, but if it was a dime turned into 100k, I'm not sure what I would have done - after I recovered consciousness.
Jeff

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REALITY
Member posted 11-18-2000 11:46 PM
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BROTHER BLADE,
WELCOME.

YOUR IN.

DO YOUR PENANCE FOR USING INDIVIDUALS REAL NAME AND SIN NO MORE...

BROTHER REALITY

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windmill
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:11 AM
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Absolutely pathetic. If the bookmaker can't hire people to check their lines, to hell with them. You post a #, you take the bet, you honor the bet. The rest is just whining crap. I've seen books cancel total bets that they claimed were bad.. 6 points off the consensus. Laughable.
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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:28 AM
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WINDMILL,
OUR FIRST SINNER!

SIX POINTS OFF THE CONSENSUS LINE AND YOU WERE LOOKING TO GET PAID?

SORRY.

YOUR DEFINITELY IN THE WRONG CHURCH...

REPENT AND SEE THE ERROR OF YOUR THINKING.

EVENTUALLY YOU WILL BE FORGIVEN AND AT LEAST YOU'LL SPLIT YOUR OVERTIME DECISIONS...

BROTHER REALITY

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windmill
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:47 AM
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At what point would you consider the # to be wrong?? 2,3,4,5,6 ?? Oh great one. Please enlighten us as to whether a # is off or the man is actually taking a stand.Oh, that's right, you want everyone to be in synchronous goose step as to the #. That is called LAZY.
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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:47 AM
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Two sides to the issue as I see it, first is keeping credibility within the bookmaking industry by posting correct lines and standing by them as people bet into them and checking then double checking that they are indeed the lines you are going comfortable with. How hard is it to get a techic to write a software program to check your lines against those of other book (check out http://www.heron-solutions.co.uk/odd...web/index.html and there are many more). Heck most books clone their lines anyway and if they cannot clone their lines with any accuracy or are putting up too many lines that they cannot check them properly then they should ask themselves why they are attempting to be a bookmaker. Thus one would have to say that if you put up a line you have to honour it or else where does it stop, how about a line that is +5 instead of -5 or a ML of 260 instead of 240? If you start reversing people’s bets because of faults by the bookmakers then how can you trust any of the lines posted on a site?
The second issue is of course that human error (or computer error for that matter) does and always will happen. Thus the bookmaker needs to have some protection from these accidents. However this obviously needs to be some form of "if the line is more than x amount different than the current average posted on donbest" or something along the lines of that, and it would need to be placed in the rules/terms listed at the book. Their does however need to be a standard and Railbird brought this up.

I am of the opinion that if you stuff it up, live with it. It does the book (and the industry) more harm than good dishonouring peoples bets whatever the reason. I believe there was a discussion recently on this forum about sportsbetting.com and its rule about dishonouring "professional gamblers" bets, and it is "roughly" the same issue. If you put up a line and people even "professional" people buy into it you have to honour it or why are you in business? If you cannot take a hit on a bad line then how solid is the book? And if your taking a huge hit and not realising it then your bookmaker is not doing his job.

A sports book is in the business of selling odds and the book is only as good as the odds it sells (and honours).


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pnanda
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:51 AM
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If it looks to good to be true, it usually is. As a bettor, one must realize this.IMHO, if a line mistake this obvious is made all bets should be voided.
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windmill
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:58 AM
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Can someone tell me exactly when this mindset of BAD LINES CAN BE CANCELLED mentality began?? Was it the advent of offshores?? You get a ticket in Vegas, they honor the bet. You bet thru locals, they BETTER honor it (one who means it). Never had a problem. Until recently with whiny offshores.
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freak
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:00 AM
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A difference of 36 points, and if one bets into that, they are trying to steal one from the book.
A honest player passes the game, or calls in the wager and says hey by the way on the net you have the line backwards.

I have done this numerous times, sometimes looking for a stipend, but not anymore. Reason being, one good turn will pay back numerous ones in the future.

Just the way I look at it anymore.

I can see the arguement, they hung the number make them pay.... Only person that will get hurt in the end is yourself. The bet more than likely will get scratched and depending on your wager style and what you attempted to do on that game if obvious will surely get you the pink slip....

Typos happen and errors do take place, but be smart and do the right thing.

See ya at the cashiers cage.....

With the correct ticket of course !!!


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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:08 AM
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quote:
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Originally posted by pnanda:
If it looks to good to be true, it usually is. As a bettor, one must realize this.IMHO, if a line mistake this obvious is made all bets should be voided.
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PNANDA,

WELCOME TO THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUETE.

AS A CHARTER MEMBER YOU WILL WIN MORE GAMES BY A HALF POINT THAN YOU WILL LOSE.

SUDDENLY YOU ARE NO LONGER AFRAID OF EXTRA INNINGS AND OVERTIME.

AMEN,BROTHER.

BROTHER REALITY


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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:11 AM
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BROTHER FREAK,
WELCOME.

YOU NOW LONGER HAVE TO FEAR THOSE LAST MINUTE PASS INTERFERENCE CALLS.

VIRTUE IS IT'S OWN REWARD.

AMEN.

BROTHER REALITY

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:24 AM
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quote:
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Originally posted by windmill:
Absolutely pathetic. If the bookmaker can't hire people to check their lines, to hell with them. You post a #, you take the bet, you honor the bet. The rest is just whining crap. I've seen books cancel total bets that they claimed were bad.. 6 points off the consensus. Laughable.
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BRETHREN OF THE CHURCH OF HONEST B.E.

LET US NOW PRAY FOR THE SOUL OF OUR LOST FRIEND BROTHER WINDMILL WHO HAS STRAYED.

MAY HE ONE DAY GROW TO SEE THE ERROR OF HIS WAYS.

MAY HE FIND THE WISDOM TO UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT OF STEAL A DIME IT WILL COST YOU A DOLLAR.

MAY HIS EPITAPH NOT READ:

I THOUGHT HONESTY WAS LAUGHABLE UNTIL HALF POINTS,BAD CALLS,AND OVERTIME DECISIONS TURNED MY FOREST INTO A TOOTHPICK...

LET US PRAY.

BROTHER REALITY


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windmill
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:31 AM
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Whatever, pal. A man that can't find his caps-lock key is indeed lost. Do me a favor. Look straight ahead, eyes wide open. Now look over you left shoulder. Now look over your right shoulder. Notice how everything looks brown?? That's cause you have your head up your ass.
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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:39 AM
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Ok, recently I have been betting on the Rugby League world cup and the bookmakers have been having some serious trouble attempting to asign lines to these games as the some of the countries playing are so immensly outclassed. Shopping between bookmakers in Aussie and the UK you could find lines that were significantly different, right now the game tonight between Aussie and Wales the spread lies between +49 and +52 (for Wales). Now why would I take +49 if I like Wales (which I do) when I can take +52 elsewhere. Is this a bad line, no its competition, but where do you draw the line between competition and bad lines?! You cannot and you shouldnt have to, its not my job to police the lines, if they are bad then take them down but dont winge and complain because your bookmaker F*%#$D itup.
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Railbird
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:52 AM
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Reality,
Do you think it was wrong for me to bet 7pt halftime teasers in Tijuana from 89-95,or my 4tmrs of side total at half to side total of game,Is it wrong that Wade Boggs always had 1 foot out of the batters box his whole career,Is it wrong that Mark McGwire takes Anabolic Steroids,Is it wrong for Vegas Casinos to have parlay cards that intentionally deceive tourists by saying 2for1 instead of 2to1.There must be clear rules.or maybe their doesent.

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Fred
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:04 AM
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with due respect to those who disagree
imho

-18 to +18 is an obvious error, (c'mon fellas, even +3 instead of -3 in say, an NBA game is an obvious error) i would be embarrased to bet it

+3 to +3.5, +4 or better, is shopping for value, i would be insane not to prefer a better genuine number


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windmill
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:10 AM
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Fred--
You would be EMBARRASSED? Would they be embarrased to keep your money after it started. C'mon. You owe them NOTHING.

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:25 AM
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BROTHER FRED,
WELCOME TO THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTTING ETTIQUETE.

YOU SHALL WIN MORE OF THOSE BAIL OUT WAGERS THAN NOT.

BLESSED ARE THOSE WHO KNOW THE MEANING OF STEAL A DIME IT WILL COST YOU A DOLLAR.

BROTHER FRED,

ALL THE BEST...

BROTHER REALITY

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Railbird
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:32 AM
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Bms intentionally will due that on htimes to throw you off,if youre on a big winning streak,I have seen it done,same thing in tennis,I will give my opponent a ball 6inches out on purpose,to win the next 3 games,and it has nothing what so ever to do with good or bad karma,its people trying to get you out of your rythym,and its done even unconsciously or vice versa.
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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:34 AM
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RAILBIRD,
I DON'T THINK IT WAS WRONG WHAT YOU WERE DOING IN TIJUANA.

THAT PLACE MADE A CONSCIOUS DECISION TO BOOK LIKE THAT.

LUCKILY THEY HAD SOMETHING ELSE GOING FOR THEM THAT ALLOWED THEM TO PAY YOU.

BOOKIEBAR,

I KNOW THOSE EUROPEAN SPORTS FLUCTUATE GREATLY SO A MAJOR LINE MISTAKE THERE WOULD BE MUCH HARDER TO SPOT THAN THE U.S. SPORTS WHERE EVERY NEWSPAPER PUBLISHES THE DAILY LINE.

REALITY

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Railbird
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:37 AM
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DO NOT SHOUT YOUR GOOD DEEDS FROM THE ROOF TOP,IT DECREASES YOUR REWARD.
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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:43 AM
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quote:
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Originally posted by windmill:
Fred--
You would be EMBARRASSED? Would they be embarrased to keep your money after it started. C'mon. You owe them NOTHING.


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WINDMILL,

IN MY ENTIRE CAREER FROM BOTH SIDES OF THE COUNTER I NEVER ACCEPTED A BAD FIGURE.

I NEVER DISHONORED A LEGITIMATE BET.

I NEVER SLOW PAID A PLAYER.

I NEVER TOOK A DEAL FROM A B.M.WHEN I OWED,AND I OWED HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS.

I BORROWED HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS TO PAY PLAYERS WHEN I BOOKED AND BOOKMAKERS WHEN I PLAYED.

IT HAS TAKEN ME THE BETTER PART OF THIS LAST DECADE TO GET EVEN.

I LIKE TO BELIEVE THAT WHATEVER DIVINITY YOU BELIEVE IN GAVE ME ANOTHER CHANCE BECAUSE I ALWAYS TRIED TO DO THE RIGHT THING AND ALWAYS WITH THE BEST INTENTIONS...

REALITY


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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 03:55 AM
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you just dont have this sort of problem at land based bookmakers, why does having an internet outlet exemplify you from honouring your clients bets? You really have to wonder why a bookmaker is making these HUGE errors and how seriously they take their business. Any half decent sportsbook is not going to be making these mistakes, and have safe guards to make sure they do not.. period.
Also if the lines are published in every paper, and they are available on line, then a sports book really has no excuse apart from laziness and incompetance.


[This message has been edited by Bookiebar (edited 11-19-2000).]

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 04:30 AM
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Right now the RLWC game (Wales Aussie)is getting pounded, Wales at +58.5 at the NSWTAB.com.au, and Aussie -52 at Willhill, so somebody has got it wrong.. (these bookies tend to move the ML rather than the points however). But I can tell you as sure as rain that I will be getting paid (if I win!) no matter what the outcome. For those who do not know a 6 point diff is the same in Rugby league as a 7pt touchdwon in NFL, so thats a VERY big diff in lines here (& even more if you took the NZTAB @+50.5 earlier before they closed).
But is it a bad line? or competition?


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AussieVamp2
Moderator posted 11-19-2000 07:24 AM
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Or different linemakers linemaking?
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AussieVamp2
Moderator posted 11-19-2000 07:30 AM
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Or a tennis example
Scud was $1.60 at one place
$1.85 at anothera couple of games ago - did either of these weasel out of them as 'bad lines'? Don't think so, that was what they put up.

Reversed sign is different, of course.

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 08:00 AM
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I would have to say diff linemakers line making! These totaliser agency boards
(TAB's) in Australasia and the UK bookies have (I suspect ;-) real bookmakers making real lines based on real money, they move the money to balance THEIR books not to follow the all the others out there, it is quite common to have a significant diff between them all when betting on these sports(www.onthepunt.com.au is a great site for checking out odds on the Aussie bookies). Great for shopping around.. Take the David Tua fight recently the NZTAB had the best odd in the world on Lewis come fight day @1.55. Why? to layoff as much of the money bet on Tua (they took over 1 million on the fight and 95% of it on Tua) as they could to minimise their risk, now thats bookmaking, having the best odds to attract the customers you want. Who cares what other bookmakers odds are as long as your balancing your books. (great scalp by the way as most others had Tua @4.00 & even 4.50).
Another example is on the RLWC game tonight (this morning US time) Will hill opened their spread on Aussie @ -52 vs Wales @ +52 $1.83 (-120) they obviously are taking money on Aussie to cover this as the spread is the same but they have moved the ML out to $2.00 on Wales to attract the buy back, complete opposite happened at the NSWTAB, spread opened at +58.5 $1.85 and Wales got hit, so the ML went up on Aussie to $2.00. Thus both bookmakers have obviously set their line wrong and it should be around +54ish and are moving the ML to compensate. Not sure why they do not move the points? But anyway you see my point the public is moving both lines to where they should be.

Both were bad lines but you will not see anybody in here tomorrow complaining they did not get paid from these book makers. As they are solid bookmakers based or registered in countries that have had laws governing bookmakers behaviour for most of this century. Not sure what the laws are exactly in these "island" countries but I would put my last nickel on them being bookmaker friendly.


[This message has been edited by Bookiebar (edited 11-19-2000).]

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sportshobby
Member posted 11-19-2000 09:40 AM
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UB made an important point that was glossed over here - THE BOOK SHOULD POST A RULE ON THIS IN THIER RULES! It should clearly state the number of points or odds difference that qualify it as an error. And there should be some mention of WHEN it can be cancelled (hopefully before the event starts), and what actions the book will take to try and contact the player.
But by NOT posting anything about this, the book fosters ill will from those who might not have known that the line was in error. Also, this kind of policy opens the door for abuse by books who might try and take advantage of the player (yes, some will).

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wintermute
Member posted 11-19-2000 10:14 AM
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Brother REALITY. I read quickly thru the replies to your post and I don't think you've mentioned anywhere what you think the difference is between a line posted in error and a good line.
I wager predominantly on sports like baseball and hockey that use moneylines and my rules of thumb are:

1) for 20 cent lines there is no problem if the line is less than or equal to 10 cents off the average posted for that game over the 12 or so books that I bet at.

2) if the line is greater than 10 cents but less than or equal to 20 cents different from the average I'll try to scalp the game but will wait an hour or so to make sure that the book will let the wager stand before covering the other side

3) if there is a difference of greater than 20 cents I avoid it. Sometimes I'll tell the book but lately I've pretty much stopped doing that because a lot of the time the person at the other end doesn't seem to have a clue what I'm talking about.

To show you what I mean here is an email I sent to a book recently. The game was a pickem NHL game between Colorado and Phoenix. The book had Phoenix at +1.5 -130!!! Everone else had Phoenix at something like +0.5 -140.

From me:

NHL game between Colorado and Phoenix is way off.

Reply:

Greetings from -sportsbook-. We are always happy to hear from our customers. Please be so kind as to specify what exactly it is we can help you with, or feel free to call us at -phone number- and we will be more than happy to assist you.

Thank you for your time and preference.

Best Regards,
-name-
Customer Service

AS you can see, polite but brain dead.

As another example, another book posted hockey lines for at least a week that had the following format.

Team A +0.5 +100 Team B -0.5 +100.

I called them up and tried to persuade one of their people for at least 5 minutes that they weren't going to make a lot of money posting lines where both sides pay off at even money but to no avail.

Does anyone keep track of their employees anymore???

wintermute

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 10:23 AM
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Sporthobby,
I agree on this that the books should either state that they honour all bets no matter what or all that don’t fall within the reaches of obvious human error, and they should state the boundaries clearly.

However, how do you think it looks when a new sports gambler stumbles across a sports book his mate recommended, places a couple of hundred down on a his fav college team, and finds out its been cancelled due to the line being "bad". Not a good look?

We had a case here when a slot machine went off and a guy won a car, while he was waiting he played the machine again and won another car! Casino said the machine was faulty, but how could it be it was just working fine a few mins ago? Anyway it went to court and a few months later the guy ended up with two cars.

Similar situation applies here the new sports gambler has no idea he is buying into a bad line, or using a faulty machine (lets assume he isn’t reading your papers with all the lines printed in them...) so why should he be the one being punished for a "faulty" line?? Its not his fault? Why does he have to know what the line should or should not be? Isn’t that what he's paying (in vig) for the sports book to sort out? That’s the bookmakers job for crying out loud if they can't do it properly, and check them properly don't do it at all.

Why do you think a casino has a camera on all its slots and technicians fixing them constantly?

I agree that if you know what you are doing you will know when a line is off, but what credibility does this give sports books when they are cancelling bets of new gamblers?? This isn't just about people who know what they are doing like most on this site but about the whole industry credibility. Why do you think there is such a backlash against online gambling? I would have to say partly from the lack of any clearly defined industry standards and until these are sorted out there is always going to be some sports books bending the rules in their favour.

Wintermute, this is my point exactly if a company cannot operate its book properly it deserves to go out of business, and on its way it shouldn't attempt to blame its customers for it's stupidity.

Just wait till the BIG casinos join the online sportsbetting business (like Harrah's is or is about to), this will be a NON-issue, they will just either not make these mistakes or they will honour them.

[This message has been edited by Bookiebar (edited 11-19-2000).]

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 10:30 AM
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BROTHER MUTE,
YOU ARE FORMALLY A MEMBER OF THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUTE.

THERE ARE NONE SO BLIND AS THOSE WHO REFUSE TO SEE...

IF YOU WERE KIND TO ENOUGH TO POINT OUT THE ERROR OF THEIR WAYS AND THEY CONTINUED TO ERR,THEN CONSIDER IT A GIFT FROM ABOVE AND PARTAKE OF WHAT IS GIVEN...

THIS IS HIS WAY OF CLEANSING THE BRAIN DEAD FROM POSITIONS OF AUTHORITY.

IF HOWEVER YOU TAKE ADVANTAGE OF AN OBVIOUS GROSS ERROR IN THE LINE WITHOUT SUCH NOTIFICATION,IT IS WRITTEN:

BE WARY OF THY ROD AND STAFF...

PEACE BROTHER,

BROTHER REALITY

[This message has been edited by REALITY (edited 11-19-2000).]

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 11:04 AM
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How do you think a book maker goes out of business?
By posting bad lines and not balancing the risk, simple, the bookmaker is in the business of selling numbers if the numbers are bad then bookmaker is bad. Why should I be held responsible for bad bookmaking?

Do you really think all these sportbooks are going to around in the next 10 years?

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 11:16 AM
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BOOKIEBAR,
THE FASTEST WAY FOR A B.M.TO GO BROKE IS WEAK OPENING NUMBERS AND MISMANAGEMENT OF THE LINE THEREAFTER DUE TO WEAK OPENING NUMBERS.

THE EXPOSURE IN THE LINE IS THE DIFFERENCE IN THE WHAT THE HOUSE HOLDS %WISE.

AS THE MOVEMENT OF THE LINE INCREASES THE CHANCES FOR PROFITABILITY DECREASES.

IT IS AN INVERSE PROPORTION.

REALITY




Author Topic: POSTING A -18 FAV. AT +18 WHAT IS A BOOK TO DO?
Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 11:33 AM
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Exactly bad bookmaking, now the problem is what is the difference between competition, bad bookmaking and obviously bad human error lines.
How to distinguish between them all? Why should it be the customer having to do this, which it is at the moment?

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 12:01 PM
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BOOKIEBAR,
INCORRECTLY POSTED LINES ARE THE EXCEPTION AND NOT THE RULE.

LET'S NOT MAKE A MOUNTAIN OUT OF A MOLE HILE.

THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS ARE:

A.HONORING A LEGITIMATE LINE THAT YOU POST

B.HONOR THE WAGER YOU ACCEPT.

C.PAYMENT ON DEMAND

DON'T ASK WHAT CONSTITUTES A LEGITIMATE LINE BECAUSE WE KNOW WHAT A LEGITIMATE LINE IS.

REALITY

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 12:04 PM
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Agreed. Point taken.
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gord
Junior Member posted 11-19-2000 12:29 PM
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Dear brethern: If thowest CONSTANTLY and SPECIFICALLY wagers into mistakes then thow should takest thine business elsewhere.
If thow thinkest there might be an error then a confirmation is necessary on thine readback and thow bet shall have honor.

Let no wager be cast aside after it has been graded

Forgive thy customers errors so that they might not hold ours against us

To those who remaineth unrepentant:
If thine bank deposits a large sum into your account....spendith thy unearned manna....
But please savest thow a quarter to calleth me and preach to me then.... on living with thine mistakes.

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 12:49 PM
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THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO BROTHER GORD:
A READING FROM THE BOOK OF HONESTY.

PROCEED BROTHER GORD>


Dear brethern: If thowest CONSTANTLY and SPECIFICALLY wagers into mistakes then thow should takest thine business elsewhere.

If thow thinkest there might be an error then a confirmation is necessary on thine readback and thow bet shall have honor.

Let no wager be cast aside after it has been graded

Forgive thy customers errors so that they might not hold ours against us

To those who remaineth unrepentant:
If thine bank deposits a large sum into your account....spendith thy unearned manna....
But please savest thow a quarter to calleth me and preach to me then.... on living with thine mistakes.

CAN I GET AN AMEN?

AMEN!

GO IN PEACE...

BROTHER REALITY


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Ronbets
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:35 PM
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This is the most entertaining thread in a long time. You can tell by my off time that I prefer reading this over the mechanical NFL.
The main question here is how many of you born again gamblers attended services this weekend? If you did, how many of you selfishly prayed for monetary gains? 1-3-4-5.........

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 01:47 PM
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BROTHER RONBETS,
ASK NOT WHAT YOUR GOD CAN DO FOR YOU,

ASK WHAT YOU CAN DO FOR YOUR GOD...

AMEN!

BROTHER REALITY

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Demon
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:06 PM
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You book a bet you pay it. PERIOD.
I dont want a book telling me "we canceled your wager because it was supposed to be -6 instead of +6" any more than they want me telling them "cancel my wager,i thought it was +8 not -8".A mistake is a mistake.I dont want to hear any crap about the books get to cancel wagers on their mistakes and the players dont.
IF I CONFIRM A LOSING WAGER,ILL PAY IT.IF THEY ACCEPT A WINNING WAGER THEY SHOULD PAY IT.
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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 02:19 PM
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DEMON,
SAINTS AND SINNERS ARE WELCOME IN THE CHURCH OF HONEST BETTING ETTIQUETE,BUT PLEASE NO BLASPHEMING OR HERECY ON CHURCH GROUND...

PEACE BROTHER.

BROTHER REALITY

[This message has been edited by REALITY (edited 11-19-2000).]

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 04:05 PM
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Double up- deleted-- yet another error from me pray I never become a bookmaker!
Amen

[This message has been edited by Bookiebar (edited 11-19-2000).]

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 04:09 PM
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REALITY,
C.PAYMENT ON DEMAND

This is also a biggie among some books, you read here of people receiving funds days even weeks later. This just isn't acceptable in the days of instant wire trasfers, paypal etc etc, if it only take one hour or 20 seconds at some books to get my money into a place it should take one hour to get it out, and I don't want to here any stalling b**locks either.

How on earth can it take 3 weeks to send money around the world? Heck I can send myself over there and pick the damn money up myself in this time and have a nice holiday on the beach at the same time.

This also should be a NON-issue.

On a side the Aussie put is a piss poor effort against Wales winning by 46-22, so at +58 on Wales I was quite safe thank you very much. Expect NZ to cover against whatever spread the bookies dream up next week...

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REALITY
Member posted 11-19-2000 04:34 PM
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BOOKIEBAR,
KNOW WHO YOUR SENDING YOUR MONEY TO.

IN THIS AGE OF UPSTART COMPANIES GIVING REDICULOUS BONUSES TO BUILD THEIR CUSTOMER BASE,YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

STICK WITH THE ESTABLISHED SHOPS THAT HAVE BUILT THERE REPUTATIONS ON SERVICE AND SURETY OF YOUR FUNDS.

SHOPS WHERE PAYMENT ON DEMAND ISN'T A MARKETING SLOGAN, IT'S A REALITY.

NO PUN INTENDED...

REALITY

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Clapton
Junior Member posted 11-19-2000 04:46 PM
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demon:
maybe you should realize that as long as there are mortals involved in the process of putting up and moving a line, mistakes are to be made. Trying to take advantage of those mistakes is as brave and wise as stealing candy from a baby. And if you expect a book to honor a 6 pts favorite on +6, then you should also expect them to be gone after football season, and your money with them.

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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 04:53 PM
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Exactly! It should be a NON-issue and at any reputable book it is. Heck william hill somethime's credits the money back on my card before it clears out for crying out loud?!
blah blah.. marketing hype.. amazing bonus's... lots of annoying pictures to download.. AND #1 WE PAY.

read -- #1 We have serious issues paying you expect to wait 3 weeks before we send you half your money to the wrong address.

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AussieVamp2
Moderator posted 11-19-2000 05:53 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by Bookiebar:
spread opened at +58.5 $1.85 and Wales got hit, so the ML went up on Aussie to $2.00. Thus both bookmakers have obviously set their line wrong and it should be around +54ish and are moving the ML to compensate. Not sure why they do not move the points? But anyway you see my point the public is moving both lines to where they should be.

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Don't move points because it is easier to balance risk and you don't get middled.


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Bookiebar
Member posted 11-19-2000 06:25 PM
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AV2, I thought as much, but they were getting middled anyhow, by offering a line 8.5pts diff from other's. Madness.
Has a NFL game ever had a point discrepancy of a 7pts between sportsbooks??
What these bookmakers posted up this morning were obvious bad lines (they soon realised it!), did they cancel everybodies bets, no, they stuck with their lines and managed their risk, no doubt if they took too much on one side they would have laid some off at another book.

And I checked my balance and what do you know I got paid... never had any doubt..

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sportshobby
Member posted 11-19-2000 06:45 PM
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OK, I know I'm on a soapbox. But the sportsbook posts all these detailed rules of operation (or maybe they copied them from someone else). If they have not posted their rules about canceling wagers on wrong lines, then there's no excuse for them.
And don't give me this arbitrary "obvious" B.S. Define the pointspread and odds difference that constitutes an error. Tell the customer when it can be cancelled, and what the sportsbook will do to try and contact the player.

Sure, everyone knows that a 36-point error is an error. It's when we get near the gray region that people don't agree. If you're going to be a nitty bookmaker who cancels a wager that is 15 cents or 2 points off, then for gosh sakes put it in your rules.

Posting no rules is just asking for a player to feel cheated, and maybe even to be cheated. You can't assume that the player always knew there was an error.

This whole thread is chastising the player trying to take advantage of a book, and that's fine. But don't overlook the othere situations - those books using this to their own benefit unfairly.

POST THE RULES!

[This message has been edited by sportshobby (edited 11-20-2000).]

[gamblero]

That is a blantant mistake and your friend should be taken in a field,blindfolded, and shot.

Spiro puts up so many different lines and by people taking advantage of mistakes ( instead of telling him) it will cost us all in the end.