Bozos at Feist

[scott]

Jeff...Jeff, your answer to "Amber" is just increadible. In your Costa Rica Revisited post you touted the many owners & employees and their vast experience & credibility. Never once did you put a name with any of your endorsments. I brought this up for your input in my own post: Costa Rica Revisited & secrecy. Help us out Jeff. Where do you stand on secrecy. No fair standing in the middle...Scotty Schettler

[thedevil]

Scotty!

You have been in this business in one manner shape or form for a long time. I don't know if you've ever been involved with an island operation. Many operators are fugitives where they can't come home. Some have a cavalier attitude that no one will ever bother them while others are scared ****less that they'll be bagged in Miami when they get off a plane. I see the points being made that they are hiding behind alias', some are some aren't. The guys at WSEX, we all know their names, are stuck there unless they surrender. Some guys feel the govt. doesn't know their names and try to stay nameless.

To the players that play at books with nameless owners, if you feel insecure, take your money out and play with places where you feel the owners are telling you their real names.

Many thought Ray Myers was a real name. Johnny DeMarco sounds real good. How do we know whats real and what isn't.

THE DEVIL

[freak]

My 2 cents worth is simply this.

With the age of technology changing rapidly in front of us everyday, there is going to be those that will continue to be the pioneers and blaze the path, and those that sit back see what they do and try to improve what seems to be working.

Those that blaze the path, will either succeed wildly or fail miserably.

Nonetheless they will be doing it to try to improve the industry in one form or another.

Who will benefit ?

I think all of us. Whether you are a client of Dana's or not, doesn't matter. There are forces that are trying to forge ahead, but the question remains what is the motive behind the madness.

We know what Dana's service offers and why they offer it. Their agenda is not hidden.

As for instant odds, what is the agenda behind it, to give players free service, but as the world knows, you never get something for nothing.....

I am not bashing instant odds one bit, Lou is being a pioneer here in my opinion, but at what cost and ultimitely who will pay the price?

Sure won't be the books........

Just food for thought.....

Good Day All

[BigMoney]

Freak, I really believe that the technology exists to set up an automated server that just passes along these live lines. Not easy, but possible. After that, you only need someone to back up and watch the computer. OK, maybe also type in the schedule. But I'm talking a 1-2 man operation.

Lou could easily take in more than enough advertising to cover that. In fact, he could end up taking in more than Don Best takes in currently via subscription fees.

[Jeff]

Scotty, TheDevil summed it up fairly well. For one, you give the gov't too much credit. While it may seem like it, they neither have the time or resources to go after each and every offshore book complete with names etc.etc.

The last round of criminal complaints came about simply by the operators coming forward with their names. There was hardly an effort on the part of the "g", other than sending a couple hundred bucks to therse places, getting someone on the phone, and asking them their names. Check out the transcripts of any of the criminal complaints.

Jay was very public. Others were asked point blank, if they were in fact the owners. Thinking they were doing nothing wrong, they said yes. The gov't said thank you very much, here's an indictment for you!

Many of the companies mentioned ARE well known by many.

You're insinuating that the reason they are not giving their names is so they can stiff people and no one will know who the are. I beg to differ. Hey, just look at Rey Meyers. You can run, but you can't hide in this biz. Just about every stiff who ever found his way to the offshore/internet biz, has been uncovered. From Top Turf, to Wagerscam, or whatever they were called. Somone always knows someone, who knows who they are.

My article was meant to recap my trip, and give a little insight. Not to name each and every owner of each and every sportsbook. Not that I would even know. Hey, you know the way it works. One guy who is respected may speak highly of another. Then the word is passed on. No different than street books.

Would I like to see the day when US based sportsbooks could be as upfront as William Hill and Victor Chandler, sure. Of course I would.

As for Johnny D, that isn't his real name, but that was already covered here.

[DeacDoug]

Jeff, I think that you underestimate the resources of the feds. If the gov't wants to get it done, it may take time but the folks in charge will do it in the end. Cohen, I believe, entered into an arena in which he was in a bit over his head. The guy made big bucks and bragged about it. He flaunted his success before the feds. Even dumb mobsters know enough to keep their mouths shut about illegal ventures. And what Cohen was doing is technically illegal in my interpretation of the law. The feds, however, had no jurisdiction to arrest him in Antigua. He make it easy for them by turning himself in. Although I respect Cohen for being a man of princple and conviction, I think that the latter will stand on appeal to excuse the pun.

[Amber]

lets see from what you say, the person i know did none of the above to get booted. Dana, cajones?...the guy wont answer a question directly...all he he does is hide behind, the notion of not discussing business in public, fine. Try asking other questions that have nothing to do with his business relationships with other books, and of course you get no answers, quick example, 2 days ago soeone posted about prices of stock quotes vs Don Bets, and the inclusion of the "Erwin" crew...no answer,.....I bet not many of your readers even know what the Erwin crew is, what a great business deal that was...say what you want Jeff, bottome line is, you have people with "member" status who have hidden agendas....just b/c you wont allow them to be exposed on your forum, doesnt mean they dont exist. and yes, the name Amber...of course...its not my name, but then again, maybe Ive been bounced from BW....so it doesnt matter....

[Jeff]

Yes,you're right. There are others,I'm sure, with hidden agendas. Some are just much more obvious than others.

I have no problem with people being anonymous. Hey, a bookmaker wants to remain anonymous, and come on here and give some insight into bookmaking or wagering, that's one thing. Players want to remain anonymous, etc.etc. No problem.

But when it reaches the level of business competitors using the forum to accomplish something, I don't think it's right.

There's enough smoke and mirrors out there in this biz, touts, sites, why contribute more.

As for Dana, hey, you can't even get by the gate of some of the major companies in America. Why? Corporate espionage. Yet you want the guy to come rigt out and lay out the blue prints.

If the price of the service is the concern here, the market will dictate which way that goes. Time will tell.

For those that aren't familiar, the "Erwin" crew refers to Jerry Erwin, who ran a service similar to Don Best.

[Don Best]

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[octan21]

Dana,

We all appreciate your coming in here and contributing. Don't let one bad apple speak for the majority.

As for your service it is simply the "best" on the market and I feel I get value for my $500 per month. If there comes a time when this is no longer true or I can no longer pick winners and have to get a real job then I will re-evaluate my feelings toward Don Best.

[Segundo]

Deacdoug, what about section b of 1084? Do you think that Cohen really violated this law? Check it out, I would like to know your opinion of why you think so.
Segundo

[bsky2]

Segundo,

Please either leave me your e-mail address or e-mail me at betthenet@hotmail.com so I can arrange to receive some of the 1084 info that you have, thanks.

[InstantOdds.com]

Freak:
As for instant odds, what is the agenda behind it, to give players free service, but as the world knows, you never get something for nothing.....
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Lou:
Never say never, Freak.
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Freak:
I am not bashing instant odds one bit, Lou is being a pioneer here in my opinion,
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No insult taken. Thanks. I always welcome a legit devil's advocate.
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Freak:
but at what cost and ultimitely who will pay the price?

Sure won't be the books........
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Sure will be Freak.

Good luck,
Lou