Sporting Index USA???

[mr green]

Does anybody use these guys? Does anybody have expierence with spread betting? It sounds quite interesting to me, but would like some other views before I try it.

[Cons]

Spread betting is an interesting idea because it means that your win/loss isn't fixed. The more you're right, the more you win. And vice versa. If the Bulls are -1 and you think they will blow away the opposition, a spread bet is a better idea.

There is no juice when it comes to the bet itself - it's simply absorbed in the line. Say the total for some NBA game is 187-190. If you bet the over (also called buying), you bet the game to go over 190 (the higher number). Is you take the under (also called selling), you bet under 187. Say you bet the over (buy) at 190 at $50/point. If the game finishes at 205, that means you win 15 times your stake (205-190=15). So you'd win $750. The limits vary, and you can probably bet 1/10 of that amount per point.

If the game finished at 182, you'd lose 8 times your stake. It's all about being as much right as possible. Because if you get something way wrong, you will pay for it dearly. It's an interesting approach to betting. Also, there's usually a win/loss limit imposed to keep out freak results. For NBA totals, it might be something like 50 points. So if you bet the over (buy) at 190, the max win/loss if 50 times your stake, so any result over 240 won't keep on increasing your winnings, just like any result below 140 won't make you lose any more.

Sportingindex is by far the best book to use if you bet US sports. I can tell you right now that they're as safe as William Hill. They are also regulated by the same body that regulates dealing on the stock market, and sportingindex probably provides vast betting opportunities on financial markets as well.

I personally use IGindex.co.uk because I mainly bet soccer, but Sportingindex is the way to go if you bet US sports, and in the case of a SFA regulated spread betting firm, is as safe as holding money in a bank. Spread betting firms are also owned by the sportsbook industry giants, at least most of them. But being regulated by the SFA is a better guarantee than even William Hill can come up with.

If you want to try out spread betting, I would open an account and play the minimum until you get the hang of it. It's a volative way of betting, and can either punish or reward you depending on how wrong or how right you are. Don't risk serious money until you feel comfortable with this way of betting and understand it completely. Victor Chandler also have a spread section, but I doubt their spread division is even close to being as comprehensive as that of Sportinindex.

[mr green]

Fantastic write up, thanks alot.

[boris]

What do you think of IGIndex Cons? I've got a few things in the post from them after seeing them online, but have never got around to having a punt there.

[Stanley]

Boris, the same thing can be said about IG Index as for Sporting Index. Very solid with decent coverage of most sports other than US sports. The only US sport they cover comprehensively is the NFL.

IG Index is IMO the second-best spread betting firm, not just because of coverage, though they cover much less ports than Sporting Index, but because, like Sporting Index, their lines are almost always up to the minute on their website www.igindex.co.uk.

Where they do have an advantage over Sporting Index is in their financial lines, which includes one for the daily closing level of the Dow Jones. These lines are updated every minute on their website.

While Sporting Index do offer lines on most US sports, the main problem with these is the closing time. They are a London-based company. So if there's no live evening soccer in England, they'll close at about 1pm EST apart from on a Sunday. That's awful early to place your bets!

Both Sporting Index and IG Index do provide live updated lines during the NFL games that are shown on British TV on Sundays [usually one of the 4.15 EST starts, though sometimes a 1pm game as well] and on these games there are a large number of props and their live supremacy bets rival WSEX's interactive bets.

So on a Sunday Sporting Index stay open to about 7.30pm EST, which is good for betting on their other US sports' lines. Hopefully as more people from across the Atlantic join them and they will become convinced of the need to stay open longer for US sports fans.

Spread betting certainly makes viewing more enjoyable than fixed odds betting as your wins/losses are affected right up to the very last action of the game. It makes great wagering because of the volatility in the payout, but like Cons said, you always have to look at the maximum downside first.

[Hamhog]

Spread betting looks like an inferior product to Action Points due to the large split line.

The typical split at Sporting Bet USA is 4 points. The Pit/Jax line is 9/12. You can play Pittsburgh +10.5 on action points. Pittsburgh would have to lose by 26 for the spread bet to be a better offer. Every other outcome favors action points.

[Cons]

Hamhog, tell us more about action points. First of all, the juice is absorbed in the line when it comes to spread betting. Maybe that's not the case in action sports...?

Also, in spread betting you can close your position at any time during a live event. If you are ahead but are afraid of a late comeback by the other team, you call and close your position, getting your profits right then and there at whatever the score at the time is. You don't have to wait to the end of the game. You can pick the right time to open and close your bets during live events.

Also, the number of betting options is enormous. You should to bet everything from how many sacking, field goals, interceptions, etc. there will be. There are loads of options to choose from.

Tell us what action points are about, I'd like to see how they compare. Though I doubt anything comes free... there has to be juice in everything, at least a little. In spread betting it is simply part of the line, so odds are absolute evens.

[This message has been edited by Cons (edited 12-01-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Cons (edited 12-01-1999).]

[Hamhog]

Action points apply to sides and totals.
The game line is used for the starting point.
The player sets a cap, typically up to 20 points for wins & losses.

Each point the players side or total does better than the game line or total, the player wins 1 unit.

Each point the players side does worse, the player loses 1.1 units.

For example, on the Pit/Jax game - assume Jacksonville wins by 7 and the player has Pittsburgh.

On action points, the player would win 3.5 units (10.5-7)

On the spread bet, the player would win 2 units (game line being 9-12).

Conversely if Jacksonville won by 20:

Action points (10.5-20)*1.1 = -10.45 units
Spread betting (9-20) = -11 units.

Spread betting offers a small advantage on large losses by the players side.

[mr green]

Stanley or Cons, one of the options that attracted me to the idea of spread betting was being able to close off a wager anytime. For instance your team is a -3 point favorite and they up 13 after the first quarter(NBA), but if Sporting Index closes at 1:30pm how could I close this bet?

[Cons]

Hamhog, what odds are the games at? If they are at -110, then it changes things slightly. Your winnings are at -110 odds, while your losses are absolute. So every "point" you win will get cut by the -110 odds, so every $100 win doesn't give a hundred. But every $100 lost is exactly that. With spread betting, every point either way (win or loss) is equal. So a 10-point loss is equal to a 10-point win.

Mr Green, check out www.igindex.co.uk as well as www.sportingindexusa.com . You can close down the bet at any time if the game is being bet on live, or bet-in-running as it's called. Not every game is going to have live betting on it, but for those that do you can open and close positions as often as you want. If the spread is 9-12, and you're betting some team -12, then you can close that position if you're satisfied with your winnings or don't want to risk a comeback. OR is you want to cut your losses. Say you're doing well and the spread moves to 17-20. Then the current 20, minus the 12 you took the bet on, will give you a win of your stake times 8.

Boris, my experience with IGIndex has been very positive. They are a professional service, SFA regulated, have live priced on their web site, and allow you to bet on the net.

I really admire their service, and one of my favourite bets must be the "grand salami" on soccer matches. The thing is that it's good to have more than one out, because lines vary. If the total for Tuesday's Champions League games is 21-22, then if you bet the over you are betting over 22. If another out has 20-21, then you're betting over 21. Regardless of the result, you're better off by a unit. If you're betting $50 per unit/goal, then whether you win or lose, you're $50 better off.

[This message has been edited by Cons (edited 12-01-1999).]

[Hamhog]

Cons,

Yes you are laying 1.1.
However, you are more than compensated by getting a 1.5 point better starting position.

[Mikes1212]

yeah, the action pts are a better deal unless your team beats the spread by 16 or more.. what sportsbooks offer action pts?? i would love to dabble around on that! what if you bet a 28 pt football underdawg? certainly you can't close off the game in the first quarter LOL,, is there a point where you can close of the game with an underdog because obviously as more time expires the better chance for the favorite to gain more pts on them.

[Stanley]

Mr green, you can only close a bet during a game if they are providing quotes (lines) in-running as Cons said. Unfortunately, at the moment all the spread bet firms only offer in-running quotes for the live (in England) NFL games on a Sunday. Usually one, sometimes two, but all of the post-season.

Relating to Sporting Index: as for NBA, there is no live NBA shown in England so they don't offer in-running quotes. The same can be said for NHL even though we do get two lives games a week. As for baseball, we get two lives games a week, though there is no in-running quotes, however they did offer it for each of the World Series games this year. On the Coolege sort front, again there are no in-running quotes, but I do remember them offering in-running quotes on a couple of the top Bowl football games earlier this year.

So I'd have to admit that for US Sports, one of the main attractions of spread betting is absent other than for a few select games each week We can only pressurise them to do more.

If you want to bet on any other sport, then the situation is much better.


Mikes1212, when a game has live spread betting on it, the quote can change at any time. Assuming this is a live (in Britain) NFL game and the pre-game supremacy quote is 27-29; if the dog scores the first seven points, then the quote is likely to be reduced to about 22-24, because it reflects whatever the linemaker thinks will be the score/supremacy at the end of the game. His opinion and the opinion of people betting on his quote will change with every play, so the quote will change with every play. Hence you can close your bet at any time based on how you think the match will end relative to how the linemaker thinks it will.


Cons, are you sure you can bet with IG Index on the net? I can't find such a facility on their website. I've written to Sporting Index recently to urge them to introduce such a facility. It would mean longer opening hours to adjust the quotes, but at least we could bet on US sports up to game time, even if not during the game.

[Cons]

Stanley, IG Index allows betting through the net, but only during opening hours so I assume each bet get approved manually. I do like the fact though that I can place bets using a Switch card without making a deposit. Sporting Index or BlueSq require a deposit to be made from the card, while IG will charge the card on a per bet basis. So you don't have to make deposits, then place your bets, then make withdrawals...

Do we get any live college sports here in the UK? Like the college football games (the bowl games) in Dec/Jan? I think they are so much more interesting than the pro stuff... any ideas if we'll be able to see them?

[Stanley]

Thanks Cons for pointing out the online betting with IG Index. I've found it now, all I have to do is wait for my password to arrive...

As far as college sports on British TV is concerned I'm not aware of any future live events. There are sometimes highlighted college football games on Tuesdays on Sky Sports, but I don't remember any of the Bowl games being shown live. The criteria for Sporting Index providing in-running quotes some of the college Bowl games earlier this year was that they had a live video feed themselves rather than being shown on British TV.